Completely agree on the narration, most of the time, especially when it was Dwight Weist or Jay Jackson, it was fine, usually Youngson was paraphrasing and extrapolating missing subtitles and keeping the plot going, with just enough historical info to give the films a little context, but always with respect to the film.
The music, especially in the early compilations, was wonderful, when George Steiner, Ted Royal or Jack Shaindlin was composing and/or conducting a pretty good size orchestra, the later ones by Skeets Alquist, John Carl Parker or Manny Albam are fine, but usually smaller combinations of musicians, and the electric guitar and bass sometimes don't work as well. But Parker does a good job cueing the band sequence from YOU'RE DARN TOOTIN' in the title sequence of FURTHER PERILS OF LAUREL AND HARDY.
Well, we can't really fault poor old Bernie Green for the "Bring Back the Laughter" song from 30 YEARS OF FUN, Youngson at his most painfully maudlin wrote it, Bernie kinda had to sing it. He did much better with the MUSICALLY MAD album and the later Enoch Light Hot Dance Band recreations.
I've found when folk are knocking Youngson's narrations, they are usually misremembering and converging them with other more hoked-up narrations of comedy clips. And knocking Youngson for cutting down films? Do they understand the concept of the word "compilation"? His films were some of the best sampler introductions to silent comedy for a mass audience ever produced, the point is one goes out and finds the complete films on their own after starting here. How dare Kevin Brownlow not show the complete features in his HOLLYWOOD THE PIONEERS documentaries!
RICHARD M ROBERTS
WHEN COMEDY WAS KING (1960) Robert Youngson
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Re: WHEN COMEDY WAS KING (1960) Robert Youngson
The "overture" of YOURE DARN TOOTIN' is really marvelous, especially as it's timed to the onscreen action. I have the Blackhawk sound print which, I presume, uses a Viitaphone disc score. It's serviceable, but not as effective or fun as the score in PERILS.
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Re: WHEN COMEDY WAS KING (1960) Robert Youngson
Richard M Roberts wrote:Rift Corbitt wrote:The youtube was mentioned on blog I visit occasionally;
https://www.newsfromme.com/2024/07/20/t ... -link-201/
"He was widely criticized for truncating and altering a lot of classic comedy and also for adding in inappropriate (some thought) music and intrusive (everyone thought) narration"
Indeed? By whom? At the time they were released I'm talking about, not the snotty twits who permeate the internet today. Youngson's use of music and sound effects were brilliant and historically accurate, and his narration was light years above any of the "let's make fun of the hokey old movie" dweebs who we hear on things like those Warner Bros compilations like HAPPY TIMES AND JOLLY MOMENTS. When he was making these compilations, Robert Youngson got nothing but heaps of praise for his work in dusting off these films and bringing them to a new audience, including Mark Evanier apparently.
RICHARD M ROBERTS
Based on my reading his Blog for 20 years and prior to that articles in the old Comic (Book) Buyers Guide; Mark Evanier probably heard criticisms first hand from "older folks" when he was child or a teen and the rest is pure extrapolation on his part. It's a blog after all :)
Be sure though, his heart is in right place.
Unrelated, his knowledge regarding It's A Mad Mad World.... and Hanna-Barbera Cartoons is vast and in case of later first hand to a degree.
Re: WHEN COMEDY WAS KING (1960) Robert Youngson
I never met Robert Youngson but as luck would have it, his cousin, Barbara Grattan, was employed at the same place I worked. She was administrative assistant to a senior VP and behaved like the regal doyen who ran the office and controlled access to her boss. A nice person but also a formidable woman, and extremely opinionated. I first met Barbara in the mid-1980s when she was approaching retirement age. One day in our company cafeteria she called out, "Which one of you is the silent movie fan?" I admitted I was, and she placed her father's copy of the 1916 script for JOAN THE WOMAN in front of me. Her dad was Erich Schay, a financial executive who worked for Lasky, Sam Goldwyn, and other pioneers in the teens and twenties. Later he branched out and was co-owner of the Metropolitan Studios in Fort Lee, New Jersey, when he died of carbon monoxide poisoning working on his car in his garage, in 1932. Barbara said that the police later told her mother that the garage doors were open but the ventilation wasn't adequate - he was overcome by the fumes.
The next day back in the company cafeteria, Barbara brought pressbooks for THE GOLDEN AGE OF COMEDY and WHEN COMEDY WAS KING, both inscribed to her by Robert Youngson. She told me he was her cousin, and as a youngster he'd be at their house all the time because her father was able to borrow films since he knew everyone in the local exchanges. Barbara remembered that Youngson would beg her father to get ahold of comedy shorts, he enjoyed those the most.
Barbara was not a film buff so she didn’t understand how some folks (like ourselves) could love the old movies. She confided to me that when "Bobby" grew up, he was still a kid at heart, obsessing over old films, spending what she considered to be too much time indoors in the dark. She could not comprehend his passion for silent movies. She worried about his enormous size, he was sedentary all day in front of a moviola, screening prints on a projector late at night, and constantly noshing. She felt he only got married because he needed someone to run his household, upkeep the apartment, and help him buy decent clothes. Eventually Youngson's wife Jeanne and Barbara had a falling out in the 1960s. Barbara always spoke her mind, and apparently some criticisms did not sit well with Mrs. Youngson.
As controller of the Goldwyn Company, Erich Schay wrote guidelines for employees that were published in book form in 1920 (see cover below). Today it’s one of the most accessible movie-related documents, available for download -- too bad it’s a dry business dissertation, and not about the movies that Goldwyn was producing back then.
The next day back in the company cafeteria, Barbara brought pressbooks for THE GOLDEN AGE OF COMEDY and WHEN COMEDY WAS KING, both inscribed to her by Robert Youngson. She told me he was her cousin, and as a youngster he'd be at their house all the time because her father was able to borrow films since he knew everyone in the local exchanges. Barbara remembered that Youngson would beg her father to get ahold of comedy shorts, he enjoyed those the most.
Barbara was not a film buff so she didn’t understand how some folks (like ourselves) could love the old movies. She confided to me that when "Bobby" grew up, he was still a kid at heart, obsessing over old films, spending what she considered to be too much time indoors in the dark. She could not comprehend his passion for silent movies. She worried about his enormous size, he was sedentary all day in front of a moviola, screening prints on a projector late at night, and constantly noshing. She felt he only got married because he needed someone to run his household, upkeep the apartment, and help him buy decent clothes. Eventually Youngson's wife Jeanne and Barbara had a falling out in the 1960s. Barbara always spoke her mind, and apparently some criticisms did not sit well with Mrs. Youngson.
As controller of the Goldwyn Company, Erich Schay wrote guidelines for employees that were published in book form in 1920 (see cover below). Today it’s one of the most accessible movie-related documents, available for download -- too bad it’s a dry business dissertation, and not about the movies that Goldwyn was producing back then.
Last edited by Ed Watz on Thu Jul 25, 2024 2:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Of course he smiled -- just like you and me." -- Harold Goodwin, on Buster Keaton (1976)
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Re: WHEN COMEDY WAS KING (1960) Robert Youngson
Rift Corbitt wrote:
Based on my reading his Blog for 20 years and prior to that articles in the old Comic (Book) Buyers Guide; Mark Evanier probably heard criticisms first hand from "older folks" when he was child or a teen and the rest is pure extrapolation on his part. It's a blog after all :)
Be sure though, his heart is in right place.
Unrelated, his knowledge regarding It's A Mad Mad World.... and Hanna-Barbera Cartoons is vast and in case of later first hand to a degree.
There were no criticisms from "older folk" about those Youngson compilations, the reviews when those films came out were estatic, everyone was delighted to be able to see anything from these films in beautiful quality then and being presented with the best bits of those films in a compilation was just fine. Gad, the free publicity that GOLDEN AGE OF COMEDY got when DCA first released it, they got raves from both Steve Allen and Jack Paar on network television, a multi-page spread in LIFE magazine, DCA couldn't have afforded that kind of publicity if they'd had to pay for it.
Like I said, those sniffy criticisms have come from the current internerd twits who want to feel themselves above anything, not that they actually are, the types whose screaming voices in their heads sing four part harmony if they think they're missing a frame of film in a non-"definitive" print of something, and who cares really what these people think? I enjoy the Youngson compilations for exactly what they are, wonderful samplings of the stuff we love that brought so many of us into this fold. I enjoy these compilations as films themselves, beautifully selected clips perfectly edited into a joyous flow of their own, with wonderful music and sound effects, and narration that works just fine, not condescending or jokey, just entertaining.
Robert Youngson was an expert editor, and he made these sort of compilations better than anyone else who tried, and frankly, his editing frequently made the films he was showcasing funnier than they were in their complete, original release. We've mentioned how he improves Laurel and Hardy's EARLY TO BED in FURTHER PERILS before, and frankly, now that we have the complete second reel of BATTLE OF THE CENTURY, I hate to say that Youngson's retooling is actually funnier and paced better.
Youngon's love for the films infuses his work, and he made us love those films as well, and search out the complete versions, but I still can pull out one of his compilations and just immerse myself in lots of the best of comedy masterfully strung together in his inimitable style, screw any nay-sayers. Mark Evanier can give those pickers of nits air space if he choses, but it doesn't mean they know what in the hell they're talking about.
William, the Blackhawk sound version of YOU'RE DARN TOOTIN was not an original Vitaphone score, it's made up of music from the old Thomas J. Valentino library and it's one of my favorite Blackhawk scores, a fine use of those music cues and sound effects that I think is trying to approximate what Youngson did with that film. I just can't watch that film without hearing the patented "Boiiiiiiiiiing" effect when someone kicks someone in the shins during that film. It's great.
RICHARD M ROBERTS
Re: WHEN COMEDY WAS KING (1960) Robert Youngson
Richard M Roberts wrote:There were no criticisms from "older folk" about those Youngson compilations, the reviews when those films came out were estatic, everyone was delighted to be able to see anything from these films in beautiful quality then and being presented with the best bits of those films in a compilation was just fine. Gad, the free publicity that GOLDEN AGE OF COMEDY got when DCA first released it, they got raves from both Steve Allen and Jack Paar on network television, a multi-page spread in LIFE magazine, DCA couldn't have afforded that kind of publicity if they'd had to pay for it.
Like I said, those sniffy criticisms have come from the current internerd twits who want to feel themselves above anything, not that they actually are, the types whose screaming voices in their heads sing four part harmony if they think they're missing a frame of film in a non-"definitive" print of something, and who cares really what these people think? I enjoy the Youngson compilations for exactly what they are, wonderful samplings of the stuff we love that brought so many of us into this fold. I enjoy these compilations as films themselves, beautifully selected clips perfectly edited into a joyous flow of their own, with wonderful music and sound effects, and narration that works just fine, not condescending or jokey, just entertaining.
Robert Youngson was an expert editor, and he made these sort of compilations better than anyone else who tried, and frankly, his editing frequently made the films he was showcasing funnier than they were in their complete, original release. We've mentioned how he improves Laurel and Hardy's EARLY TO BED in FURTHER PERILS before, and frankly, now that we have the complete second reel of BATTLE OF THE CENTURY, I hate to say that Youngson's retooling is actually funnier and paced better.
Youngon's love for the films infuses his work, and he made us love those films as well, and search out the complete versions, but I still can pull out one of his compilations and just immerse myself in lots of the best of comedy masterfully strung together in his inimitable style, screw any nay-sayers. Mark Evanier can give those pickers of nits air space if he choses, but it doesn't mean they know what in the hell they're talking about.
RICHARD M ROBERTS
I couldn’t agree more, Richard. Robert Youngson’s silent comedy compilations were so perfectly tooled for greatest impact that respected documentarians like Paul Killiam and Kevin Brownlow attempted to copy his technique. But they could never duplicate Youngson’s success. Neither could Raymond Rohauer (his sole contribution was THE CRAZY WORLD OF LAUREL & HARDY, and the title tells you what’s wrong with it).
Although I enjoy all of the Youngson features, my three favorites are THE GOLDEN AGE OF COMEDY, WHEN COMEDY WAS KING, and the last one released, FOUR CLOWNS. The first two seem the most perfect to me, and the last one is a standout for its overdue tribute to Charley Chase.
Surely no one in that era made a stronger case for Chase than Youngson, and the same can be said for his efforts to elevate and remind people that Harry Langdon was also one of our great comedians. Youngson took Langdon’s first Sennett short SMILE PLEASE, and edited it into a far better and funnier representation of Harry’s emerging comedy style than the rather crude complete film deserves.
I only recently caught up with 50 YEARS BEFORE YOUR EYES (1950), Youngson’s first compilation which only includes a few scenes representing silent comedy. But even here, the footage edited from Charlie Chaplin’s HIS NEW JOB was probably the first time I laughed at anything from what I considered Chaplin’s dullest of his Essanays. Dave Glass rightfully remarked that Billy Bevan was featured in more of Youngson’s comedy compilations than any other comedian - and Billy is likewise featured here in classic footage from BE REASONABLE.
Years ago, the only complaint I’d very occasionally hear from film buffs was that “not all of these films survive in complete form, why didn’t Youngson make reference copies?” But in truth, for the most part he did exactly that. In recent years we’ve had complete or nearly complete versions of THE BATTLE OF THE CENTURY, THE SECOND 100 YEARS, THE STING OF STINGS, LIMOUSINE LOVE, PASS THE GRAVY, THE LUCK O’THE FOOLISH, THE CAMERAMAN and other titles turned up. Not all, but many of these came from Robert Youngson’s personal collection, or better quality editions that derive from his source material. So he was also a preservationist, after all.
"Of course he smiled -- just like you and me." -- Harold Goodwin, on Buster Keaton (1976)
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